今日からほぼちょうど1年後、私たちはサイトを大きく変更することを決め、初期設定のWordPressコメントに代わってLivefyreコメントシステムを導入しました。Livefyreコメントシステムは、私たちが当初から惚れ込んだ製品で、Livefyreの皆さんと素晴らしい関係を築くことができました。残念ながら、私たちの最近のオーバーホールで、私たちはLivefyreと別れる決断をしました。多くのユーザーから、新しいデザインと変更点についての詳細な投稿をするよう求められていました。最も多かった質問は、なぜLivefyreから乗り換えたのかというものでした。この投稿では、Livefyreから離れ、初期設定のWordPressコメントに戻すという決断についての洞察をお伝えします。
私たちが最初にLivefyreに惚れ込んだ理由
Livefyreはリアルタイムのコメントを提供し、登録が必要なためスパムを「減らす」ことができ、ソーシャルメディアと統合され、会話をサイトに戻すことができた。Livefyreは、facebookやtwitterなどとのサインオンも可能でした。サーバー負荷の軽減というフィードバックも頭の片隅にありました。すべて素晴らしいと思いましたが、サイトが大きくなるにつれ、いくつかの問題に直面することになりました。
一体何が起こったのでしょうか？
1.リアルタイムでコメントする
リアルタイムコメント機能では、コメントすることでチャットのような会話を楽しむことができました。今までコメントした中で最高のエンゲージメント体験でした。しかし、リアルタイムコメントはモデレートするのが難しくなりました。スパマーは、私たちのサイトですべてのコメントを承認されるまで、個別登録しかないことに気づいたのです。
注：通常、ユーザーのメールやIPアドレスを公開することはありません。これはスパマーであり、私たちは彼らの身元を明らかにすることが公正であると考えています。
話を戻そう。そのため、私たちは定期的に多くのコメントを削除していました。中には私たちの目を逃れて、ユーザーがそれを見てスパムとして報告するまで何ヶ月も残っているものさえありました。我々はこれらのコメントをモデレートしながら、この機能を維持した理由の一つは、ユーザーのリンクは、実際のサイトではなく、彼らのlivefyreプロフィールを指していたということでした。だから我々は、悪質な近隣サイトにアウトリンクしていなかった。Livefyreは、ユーザーが自分のウェブサイトのリンクを追加することができ、ウェブサイトのパブリッシャーにこのオプションに対するコントロールを与えない新機能を起動することを決めたとき、これは終わりに来た。私たちは、スパムコメントの増加を見始めたので、すぐにリアルタイム機能を無効化しました（これは、そもそも私たちがLivefyreに魅了された主なものでした）。
2.スパムのように
私たちをこのアイデアに引き込んだもののひとつは、登録が必須であればスパムを減らせるというものでした。それは全くの間違いでした。Livefyreには「いいね！」という機能がある。これは明らかに素晴らしい意図で作られたものだ。しかし、このシステムは悪用されている。そのプロセスを説明しよう。登録されたユーザーなら誰でも、コメントした内容に同意すれば「いいね！」をすることができます。ユーザーがコメントに「いいね！」をすると、そのユーザーのアバターがコメントの横に表示され、そのユーザーのサイトに直接バックリンクされます。言うまでもなく、これはDO-FOLLOWバックリンクである。下のスクリーンショットは、Livefyreのブログのスクリーンショットである。
上の例では、このスパマーはあまり賢くない。彼は初期設定の謎の男のアバターを使っている。私たちのサイトのスパマーはもっと賢かった。彼らは自分のロゴをアバターにしていた。そのため、スパム的なSEOサイトやクレジットカードオファーサイトなどにリンクされているカラフルなミニアイコンの束を目にすることになる。信じられない人もいるかもしれないが、これは実際に起こっていることなのだ。下記は、ほぼ1ヶ月前にLivefyreに報告したユーザーのプロフィールです。
今のところ対策はとられていません。このスパマーのプロフィールはまだ有効化されているか、少なくとも有効化されているように見えます（表示されているため）。さて、この人は本当に自分が読む個別コメントが大好きなのか、それともスパマーなのか。私たちは後者を信じることにする。私たちを信じないで、彼のプロフィールに記載されているサイトのリンクをチェックしてみてください。
今、あなたは私たちが上で説明したことを悪いことだと考えている。最悪なのは、誰があなたのサイトの何に「いいね！」を押したのかが通知されないことだ。誰があなたのサイトをスパムしているのかを知る方法がないのだ。それを知る唯一の方法は、ユーザーから報告されるか、過去の投稿を偶然見てこれに気づいた場合です。
私たちは、サイト内の数多くの投稿で「いいね！」スパムの被害にあっていることを知ったとき（そしておそらく、私たちが知らないだけで、もっと多くの投稿があるのだろう）、すぐに乗り換えなければならないと思いました。私たちは無力で、コントロールできないと感じた。コンテンツを所有しないことの弊害のひとつだ。
3.ソーシャル会話
ソーシャル会話は、Livefyreが提供する非常に素晴らしいオプションです。TwitterやFacebookからの会話を投稿に反映させることができる。理論的には素晴らしいことだが、まだ完璧ではない。私たちは、Twitterから来る多くの無関係なコメントを見た。良いアイデアだが、もっと完成度を高め、より良いフィルターが必要だ。私たちのサイトでもこの機能を試してみたが、あまりうまく機能しなかった。
4.モデレーション
Livefyreを使用する際、私たちは、LivefyreとWordPressデータベースとの間に双方向通信があるという印象を持っていました。つまり、WordPressのモデレーションを使って、コメントを承認、削除、返信することができるということです。しかし、それは真実ではありませんでした。当初はうまくいっていたように思えたのですが、最近になって裏目に出てしまいました。Livefyreプラグインを更新したところ、突然、モデレーションを保留しているコメントが数百件も出てきたのです。すでにモデレートしたコメントはすべて戻っていた（そして保留中とマークされていた）ことがわかった。何が起こったのかはわかりません。Livefyreのサポートに連絡し、レスポンスをもらいました：
WordPressダッシュボードからコメントをモデレートしようとしているようですが、ダッシュボードの変更はLivefyreに同期されません。
つまり、ダッシュボード内の変更はLivefyreに同期されません。どのアップグレード状況だったか覚えていませんが、それは物事を台無しにするようでした。親友のミッチ・キャンター（@studionashvegas）と話したところ、彼のサイトでもうまくいっていたそうです。彼のサイトではまだ機能していると言っていた。何がいけなかったのか完全にはわからないが、それにもかかわらず、何百ものコメントを再修正しなければならない状況になった。
これが機能するためには、リブファイヤーモデレーションパネルを使ってコメントをモデレートする必要があると言われました。私たちが最初からlivefyreの管理者パネルを絶対に嫌だと思った理由はいくつかあります。
- 一括モデレーションができない – 複数のコメントを削除したり、スパムとしてマークしたい場合、それを簡単に行う方法がありません。個別に行う必要があります。この問題は、新規インターフェースでも変わりません。
- 劣悪な個別モデレーション – 単純にコメントを削除するには2回のクリックが必須。一つは削除の決定、次に削除の理由を述べること。これは面倒なことです。これは新規インターフェースでも問題である。
- コメントのコントロールができない – 私たちが乗り換えを決めたとき、ユーザーのコメントを編集するオプションはありませんでした。そのため、コメントガイドラインを実施するのが難しくなりました。例えば、誰かが素晴らしいコメントを残したのに、署名リンク（私たちがする権限がありません）を貼ってしまったとします。私たちはそのコメントをそのまま受け入れるか、削除しなければなりません。これは新しいインターフェースで修正されました。コメントを編集できるようになりました。
- 返信先が面倒 – 私たちのようなサイトでは、しばしばコメントに返信する必要があります。これを行う簡単な方法はありません。livefyreのモデレーションパネルでコメントを見ることができます。あなたは保留中のコメントを見ることができる投稿を開く必要があります。それを承認し、そこから返信してください。これでは、Livefyreのモデレーションパネルはほとんど役に立ちません。WordPressのバックエンドのモデレーションでは、返信と承認というとてもクールな機能があります。そのため、投稿の新しいタブ/ウィンドウを開くことなく、コメントに返信することができます。
5.フォーマットの問題
私たちは、Livefyreが一部のユーザーのコメントテキストとして追加のCSSを追加していることに気づきました。それはほんの一握りのユーザーだけに起こっていたので、ある種のユーザー側の問題に違いありませんが、私たちはすべてのユーザーを大切にしています。修正されたかどうかはわかりません。
もうひとつ気づいたのは、コメントする際に改行を入れるのが面倒だということです。そのため、私たちは誰かに返信してリンクを貼り付けようとしていました。しかし、Livefyreのオートフォーマットは改行を削除してしまいます。時にはリンクが切れてしまうこともあったので、リンクとそのあとのテキストの間に余分なスペースを入れなければなりませんでした。最大の問題は、入力中にShift + Enterを使うと、改行があったことが表示されることです。下の画像を見てください：
6.公正な妥協ではない
Livefyreを使うことを決めたとき、私たちはいくつかの妥協をしました。Livefyreがプロバイダーとして提供する他のクールな機能を得るために、いくつかの機会をあきらめた。しかし、Livefyreを広範囲に使用し、欠点を見た後、私たちは公正な妥協をしなかったと感じました。少し詳しく説明しましょう。
カスタマイザーなし
Livefyreに乗り換えたとき、私たちはこのことをよく知っていました。サードパーティのスクリプトを使用するときはいつでも、スタイリングの一部をコントロールできなくなります。現在、私たちのコメントデザインはテーマと一致しており、美しく見えます。Livefyreでは、見た目のコントロールがあまりできませんでした。Livefyreには、一般ユーザーが利用できるホワイトラベル設定はありません。しかし、このサービスは企業レベルのカスタマーのために提供されていると考えています。
コメントからのリードジェネレータはありません。
Livefyreに切り替えた時点で、コメントフォームからのリードジェネレーションの機会を失うことは分かっていました。私たちは、コメントからニュースレターを購読する機能をユーザーに提供するだけでなく、初めてのユーザーのためにコメントリダイレクトを行っていました。私たちは、これを追加することについてLivefyreチームと話し合いました。結論は、シンプルな解決策はないということでした。彼らが提案した解決策は、利用可能なAPIがあり、それを使って彼らのシステムにフックし、ユーザーがチェックボックスにチェックを入れた場合にメールを収集できるというものでした。コメントリダイレクトする方法はありませんでした。
私たちのチームのフィードバックは次のようなものだった：
このプラットフォームを使い、私たちが望む機能を得るためには、自分たちで構築しなければならない。このプラットフォームを使い、欲しい機能を手に入れるためには、自分たちで構築しなければならない。プラグインもすでにたくさんある。満場一致で決定した。
サードパーティ登録
繰り返しになるが、Livefyreを使用するためにサインアップした時点で、このことは承知していた。私たちのサイトにコメントするために、ユーザーにサードパーティ・サービス「Livefyre」への登録を必須としなければならないことは承知していた。私たちは、有意義な会話やその他の機能が追加されるため、それがより大きな利益のためであると信じていました。私たちが参加したWordCampのすべてで、いつも何人かのユーザーが現れ、コメントシステムに不満を述べていました。また、それに関するユーザーからのメールも多数ありました。ファイアウォールの内側でコメントすることに困っている人や、WPBeginnerにコメントする自由が失われたと感じている人もいました。はい、数ヶ月前にLivefyreはゲストコメントする機能を追加しました。しかし、その後にLivefyreにサインアップすることをユーザーに勧めている。これはまた公正な妥協ではありませんでした。我々はユーザーを失望させた。彼らの多くはコメントするのを止めた。私たちがミスをした場合など、私たちに知らせるためにメールでコメントする人はほとんどいませんでした。これは私たちにとって本当に残念なことでした。これらのユーザーの中には、WPBeginnerにサインアップするのであれば、喜んでコメントするために登録するだろうと言う人もいました。しかし、私たちは彼らにサードパーティとのサインアップを必須としていました。私たちはこの件についてLivefyreと話し合いました。Livefyreは、独自のユーザーベースを維持できるエンタープライズAPIを持っています。ユーザーデータはすべてあなたのものです。しかし、統合プロセスはそれほど簡単ではなさそうだった。すべてを覚えているわけではありませんが、基本的には、すべてのユーザーを保持するために、bbPressかBuddyPressの区切りデータベースを作成する必要があります。あまりに混乱しそうだった。私たちはそれを進めないことにしました。
当時、これらの妥協は、Livefyreで得られるすべてのクールな機能に比べれば、大したことではないと思えました。しかし、時間が経つにつれて、私たちの経験から、より明確なイメージを見ることができました。
では、今はどうなのか？
さて、私たちはビルトインWordPressコメントシステムに戻しました。何人かのユーザーから、下にあるTwitter/Facebookでサインインするオプションを追加するために何を使っているかという質問をメールでいただきました。私たちは、Simple Twitter Connectと Simple Facebook Connectという2つのプラグイン（同じ投稿者@otto42による）を組み合わせて使用しています。
2012年10月12日更新：TwitterログインとFBログインの両方のオプションを削除しました。これらのオプションはロード時間に大きな影響を与えます。私たちはむしろ、大多数の人にとってサイトがより速くなることを望んでいます 
我々は、Livefyreを愛用している数多くのユーザーに会い、話を聞いた。Livefyreは私たちのサイトには合いませんでしたが、ご自分のサイトで試してみるのは大歓迎です。Livefyreについてのあなたのフィードバックをお聞かせください。ご意見があれば、お気軽に以下にコメントしてください。
Dirk
I like how your comments are styled, nice work!
Chetan Bhasin
Do they not have a spam policy on Livefyre, or is Akisment not working with Livefyre?
Well! I was testing Livefyre for a blog but then read this.
While I really like the social login and tagging feature on Livefyre, I can not risk my website to spam comments.
Dennis Marshall
I just decided to use LifeFyre. I have it on another blog and it seems to be pretty stable. I’ll give it 90 days.. Great Post though.. I’ll be sure to link to you guys..
Steve Wilson
I was gonna try Livefyre but then i read your post and ah… thanks buddy. I may have to stick with Disqus anyway. Oh what can you say about Disqus then?
Kathy Korman Frey
I basically did this as well. Felt sort of “doe in headlights” after this post.
Scott
What do you use for comment spam? akisment or what? thanks in advance…
Editorial Staff
We use Akismet. But we also have Sucuri which takes care of a lot of spam and malicious requests.
管理者
Danny Cruz
I have a question. I’ve had Livefyre on my guitar site for a few years now, but I was recently considering getting rid of it. In doing the research to decide whether to remove it or not, a search led me here. Great piece by the way.
My question is… When you delete Livefyre, do you lose all the comments made through the system? Or do they somehow go into your WP comment interface?
Editorial Staff
Livefyre comments are stored in your WordPress database, so they will still be there even when you disable Livefyre. The only thing that gets messed up is the conversation threading.
管理者
Linda S
Ah. now I see this. Thank you. I’ve made a long comment elsewhere that all free Livefyre “community comments” users will need to get off of this plugin now thanks to Adobe’s purchase.
Spencer Edgington
I like Disqus better …
Steve Wilson
Me too, i used for all my commenting because its pleasant to the eye and its very easy to track my comments with.
Jalil Asaria
You might want to have a look at Viafoura.
Full disclosure I work for them. But we actually displace livefyre for the ver reasons you pointed out.
PolarStar
Hi, Which plugins are you using to personalize the default comment section you have now? I mean the notify me of followup and subscribe to WPBeginner below? Also I like that people on this web use their photos. Is it only because they have Gravatar accounts?
Thanks, Polar
Editorial Staff
You can see how our comment system works here: https://www.wpbeginner.com/blueprint/comments/
As for photos, yes it is through gravatar.
管理者
PolarStar
Thank your fore the reply!
himagain
Hi there!
Actually, I’ve left a couple of replies above.
But aside from getting confirmation here about dumping livefye, it helps to know that I was not alone.
BUT – it still for an unknown reason means I cannot comment on Sites running Livefyre – despite the fact that I am a member!
AND am going to look into knocking off this Theme, later!
Cheers!
Shashi
Good information about the advantages and disadvantages of Livefyre. Thanks for your time to mention all of them.
Chris
I didn’t like it either, the new Disqus is much better for that matter. And hey can you share how to make the social media share icons scroll down along with the post? Like you have it here?
Paul Shapiro
I got freaked out on my blog when I saw spammers liking comments on my posts, but I checked and the links are now “nofollow”. FYI.
Editorial Staff
Must have been a recent change that they made. However even with a nofollow link, sending traffic to spammers is not ideal. Your competitor can easily click like on all comments on your post, and they will get clicks. Would you like to send traffic to your competitors?
管理者
mre
Anyone know of an OPEN SOURCE commenting system?
Editorial Staff
Yup, the built-in commenting system.
管理者
MRE
My bad, I was commenting from my phone, not realizing this was a Wordpress blog about Wordpress. I meant a 3rd party, open-source code API comment system – like what Chromium is to Chrome or Linux is to Mac.
I want to use on a Scriptogram blog.
Mrinal
Just saved me. I was going to install it. Thank you.
MichaelADeBose
Great post. I’ll be putting up a blog soon and your post gave me some things to consider. It’s funny because I am experiencing an issue with Disqus where regardless of using Twitter sign-in or their interface and clicking that my comments on whichever site be sent to my Twitter feed, it has not been happening. For me that is important, first and foremost because it is a feature that is provided and so you would expect it to work. It’s not worked in over a week and despite interacting with some of Disqus staff, its still not working.
Getting ready to put up my own blog, between your post and my own experience, its clear that people are quite enthusiastic about comments and apparently for quite a few different reasons. It’s clear to me that I really need to weigh the options. From my sad Disqus experience, I am imminently aware that my commenter’s comments after they leave my site are as important to me as when they are on my site and I need a commenting system that both myself and my commenters can trust to do what its supposed to as its advertised. Then to your point I also need something that functions with the level of control I want, within a reasonable envelope of effort. I’m still looking for the answer, but you’ve helped me articulate for myself much more focused questions. Thanks.
Brendan
Just curious what your thoughts were on Livefyre’s StreamHub… it’s an enterprise system they offer. I’m concerned about the Do Follow on the likes you had mentioned along. However, I am able to modify comments from people who leave links in their comment. I will stick with Livefyre for at least a few months as our comments have increased 400%! Cheers.
Editorial Staff
StreamHub is a new technology they added after we switched away. So we cannot comment on those features.
管理者
Robert le Grange
I like this topic a lot, every time I catch a good read (this is one of best) I get sucked into the hunt for the perfect solution. It appears this one is solid.
One thing I would like to see happen is when a sign-in via twitter is completed that the page is jumped to the input box, otherwise lots of scrolling especially on this popular post.
What about Google sign-in integration?
Editorial Staff
We haven’t integrated Google, but we might consider in the future.
管理者
Elijah
Now you’ve just talked me out of installing Livefyre. Good read.
Arul
I was thinking about going with livefyre for the exact reasons.I simply love real time comments. Not creates a flaming argument like those and to me I thought the drawbacks are very little until I read this and now I using your own comments blueprint :). Slightly shameful in copying your entire commenting layout.
Tony Greene
Valid points for your dismissal of the awesomeness that is Livefyre. It’s not for everyone as you point out.
By the way, it looks like your twitter token is failing and the facebook button has failed to load properly.
Not a good look if you’re trying to keep the conversation going…
Editorial Staff
Yup, its a great product just not for everyone. It was in the list of to-do to get rid of both FB and Twitter connect options. Finally got rid of them.
管理者
Amber Hewitt
May I ask why you got rid of the social network sign-ins? I was thinking of adding them to my site.
Editorial Staff
Mainly because people weren’t using it as much. Almost everyone was using the name/email method. Very few were using social connect. Keeping social connect buttons on the page meant numerous additional HTTP requests and slower page load time. We decided to improve our page load time by a few seconds by getting rid of those options that people weren’t really using.
Carlos Mendoza
What is the system of comments that you are using right now!
Editorial Staff
It is default WordPress comments. You can see our blueprint link in the sidebar that will show you how we created our comments.
管理者
Carla
I am looking for a setup where discussions can happen in real time. I like Go To Meeting but I want it to be more of a commenting platform vs. a chat room platform. This is also going to be behind a membership setup and later transcripts will be added for others to read.
Does anyone have any ideas on this type of setup within Wordpress?
Editorial Staff
Behind a membership site, I think that Livefyre may be worth a try (specially if it is paid membership) because then you will weed out a lot of SPAM. Also consider looking at the P2 theme.
管理者
Reasonably Good
Hi, we’re having similar debates over commenting systems & have discounted using Disqus & livefyre due to lack of control/ownership of discussions.
Can i ask if you’ve looked at IntenseDebate? It’s main attraction to us is that comments are hosted on your own DB and seem to work in tandem with WP’s own comment system. In fact, according to Mashable, Automatic (WP’s owners) have bought IntenseDebate so it should sync in really well.
It appears to offer the FB & Twitter integration most people want and offers a growing list of 3rd party add ons too.
Would like to hear your take on it if you’ve given it the once over.
Editorial Staff
We used intense debate briefly on a client’s site. Even livefyre and Disqus hosts keeps a backup of your comments in your database (which makes it easy to switch back). Yes its true that Automattic bought Intense Debate. It seems though that they are more focused on JetPack comments now. We probably would not use another third party commenting system anytime soon.
管理者
Oliver Nielsen
I recently killed Jetpack on my site, as I hate the default on-status of the modules. No control with what’s activated and what isn’t, after updating Jetpack.
So I came here to read peoples experiences with Livefyre and Disqus. I’ve had terrible experiences with IntenseDebate a few years ago, so I’m very wary about trying those two alternatives.
Daniel Green
I’d been using Livefyre for a while now, but in the past week my spam comments sky rocketed to 70 odd in the space of a couple of days.. and not just a sentence or two but huge paragraphs of nonsense. Then I found out that for some reason the plugin had just stopped working all together. (I couldnt login OR post as guest). The fact is though, ever since using LF the only comments I ever received were Spam.
Previous to this I tried Comment_Luv, but this just turned out to be a blogging Circle-Jerk. People would only comment on other Com Luv enabled sites, just to get those special backlinks. This also rendered commenting on blogs without the plugin useless, or at least far less appealing.
So now I’m trying Disqus. For one thing, you get access to moderation through the WP-admin panel (via a secondary login), so you dont have to leave WP. The 2012 update also seems quite appealing. You have the option to sign in via the usual twitter, facebook and google, but you can also just leave your name email and website, similar to standard WP comments.
Editorial Staff
Yeah one of the reasons why we disable links on our site is because we don’t want users to comment on the site just for the sake of backlinks. If you want to say something and add value to the content, you will do so regardless of the link or not. In the future, we may work out some sort of loyalty based program, but that is not the priority at the moment.
管理者
Meghan Krane
I’m Meghan with Livefyre. Did you ever contact our customer support regarding your spam issues? Had you contacted us we would have looked into this immediately and worked to resolve the situation. We haven’t received any customer complaints from anyone in our network about paragraphs of spam in Livefyre comments, and we definitely want to investigate this matter further. We weren’t able to locate you anywhere in our database, would you mind sharing the URL of your site with us?
himagain
@meghan HAHAHA! You couldn’t find anyone here??
I’ve been going nutz trying to get ANYTHING to work on YOUR Site.
On several of my key contact Sites I can no longer post messages.
It has taken quite a lot of frustrated detective work to realise it is YOUR system causing my problems.
A really dumb message comes up as I try to post and it doesn’t matter whether I try to bypass Livefyre or not I get:
“It seems you’re attempting to post malformed content.”
I AM registered in your operation.
I cannot get ANY response from your Website Support at all.
Try to place a support message and it will bomb you out with a script error of its own:
“You haven’t selected a topic” – Ihad – twice!
Typed in a long supprt report and to add insult to injury -the above error simply alsowipes your message!
Email didn’t work either.
SO there is a good reason that you aren’t getting complaints – we can’t post them!
Amber Hewitt
I found this article while researching Wordpress commenting systems. I was going to pick Disqus or Livefyre, but after reading your article, I’ll try the built-in Wordpress commenting system with a few plugins. I looked up Otto42’s plugins to download and found one by Otto42 that solves a different problem I have!
Thank you!
Rourke Decker
Just a little tip: The verbiage under Add a Comment should read, “We’re glad you have chosen to leave a comment.”
I am giving serious thought to removing Livefyre from my own site (the main reason why I found your article). The problem is I would probably also lose the majority of my readership. They come to my site for the real-time interaction that Livefyre offers, which is lacking in the default Wordpress commenting system.
A wonderful compromise would be for the Livefyre plugin not to entirely hijack the commenting system, allowing people who don’t want to sign up for Livefyre (or who are behind corporate firewalls, which has been a big problem for my readers) to leave comments through the default interface. That would be the best of both worlds.
Editorial Staff
Fixed the verbiage.
As for real-time comments, you can see how P2 theme allows for real-time comment notifications. Require user to register on your own site, and go that route.
管理者
Rourke Decker
But it still requires refreshing the page to see the new comments, right? That’s why we went to Livefyre in the first place — to obviate the need for refreshing constantly.
Editorial Staff
Well, unfortunately no one has gone ahead to turn this technique into a plugin yet:
http://coding.smashingmagazine.com/2012/05/09/building-real-time-commenting-system/
Joey
This works very well: http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/wp-ajaxify-comments/
Andy Bailey
Excellent article, I really enjoyed reading this and the points you made about no custom styling and the disadvantages of 3rd party registration issues were interesting.
And its an interesting thing to remove the URL field to combat spam, do you find that your legitimate comments have decreased because of this?
I made the commentluv plugin and I think I can integrate a sort of halfway measure in to the premium version if removing the URL field is working for you… How about only enabling it if a user has made a certain amount of approved comments?
I could set the plugin to recognise the email address and if it was a user who had left the right amount of comments, it could reveal the URL field.
What do you think? I’d be really interested to hear your thoughts…
Editorial Staff
Andy, I don’t think legitimate comments went down because of no URL field. We have seen an increase in comments since taking out Livefyre. A lot of the users who stopped commenting (because of registration) are now back. We did see a SIGNIFICANT increase in SPAM comments, but Akismet is doing a really good job at filtering those.
I’m looking at it from this perspective. If you were going to comment to add value, you will comment regardless of the link. Worried about identity? Your gravatar is there, people can still identify you. We don’t want comments like “Great article”. Often folks leave those type of comments because they are commenting for incentive (backlink).
Your suggestion of the loyalty reward is a good idea. I’ve been thinking of ways to add some sort of reward system in WPBeginner (still in early thought phase). Still not sure how I want us to approach that. I think your idea is very solid, and a lot of folks can benefit from it.
One thing I want to do though is NOT add a link input field for everyone. It should only appear to those with the right email. For example, once a user hits an XXX amount of comments, an automated email gets sent out. The user can choose to display their Twitter. After they hit XXX, then we let them have their website URL. I hope I’m making sense. Also it would be cool to detect user’s email and show up badges next to their name.
管理者
himagain
Just butting in here: ME TOO!
I’d be interested in your proposal there -and I don’t even know the commentluv package… yet.
Paul
This is very interesting, I currently use Disqus on my site and since their recent upgrade, which I believe has added a lot of features which livefyre has. Since the upgrade I’ve not really like the experience you get with it and thinking of moving back to the Wordpress comments.
Since reading this article it has made up my mind to remove Disqus and go back to using the Wordpress comment system and get control back.
Joey
Interesting. Let’s see how and when Livefyre handles these issues.
I’m unable to integrate FB and twitter connect the exact same way you guys have. Can you explain how that was done?
Also, any chance of an advanced article on making themes with genesis?
Editorial Staff
Not sure what you mean by not able to integrate it like how we have. Are you talking about styling? If so, then we simply styled the div those two buttons are wrapped. That is just CSS. To add that separator, you may have to edit your comment form. Our theme is a custom Genesis Child theme and we had to do that. There are no immediate plans of showing “how-to” build a theme. Because there are so many levels of users. Not sure at what point we start teaching WordPress theme development vs. HTML / CSS.
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Emily
That sounds like a pain. I wasn’t around during the Livefyre comments but compared to the screenshots, the new comments also fit the site a lot better. I almost went for them just for the connect with Twitter and Facebook features, but because you posted links to completely separate plugins for that, I’m not even going to try Livefyre and instead go straight for the two other plugins, which look great.
Andreas
Do you know the “Social” plugin by Mailchimp? I think it improves the commenting system a lot and keeps all the comments “inhouse”.
Editorial Staff
Yes we are aware of that. Just didn’t like the UI.
管理者
Faris
Why don’t you guys use the Official Facebook for Wordpress plugin
http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/facebook/
Editorial Staff
First because it JUST came out. Second, because it doesn’t have the Facebook Connect for default comments. It has Facebook Comments which is what we don’t want.
管理者
Gautam Doddamani
and thirdly it creates a conflict with the fb open graph meta tags…wpbeginner is already using it in his header files…if we activate that plugin graph protocols may become broken
Albert Albs
Thanks for the update. Yes seen some spamming over the comment author profiles with LiveFyre system. Your decision is correct. I would suggest adding Comment Author URL form with No-Follow attribute to encourage decent commentators. And use Akismat spam plugin. That is it. 80% Problem solved.
Also as I said earlier, I’m not getting any comment notification, even after selecting the “Notify me of followup comments via e-mail” option.
Also check out: Today Jetpack shipped Comment system for self-hosted WordPress blogs. I will mention you in the Google+ Post.
Gautam Doddamani
albert, website field is already external nofollow by default in wordpress…as wpbeginner stated in one of the comments..dey r using it to further help reduce spammers.
and about the notification problem have you ticked the box and then added your comment? if so u should be getting notificiations!!
i dont use jetpack..but wil try it today..thanx for the update..jetpack is growing a lot these days..apart from ATD and sharedaddy implementation i believe all other plugins are not so useful in it.
Albert Albs
Hi Gautam, Thanks for the inputs regarding Comment Author URL field.
About Notification problem: Yes. I clicked that check box (“Notify me of followup comments via email”). And your reply to my comment also did not come as a notification.
I manually checked this post for any reply and commenting now.
B/w All the time I logined using my Twitter account.
Keith Davis
Sorry for second comment guys – only just noticed that you are running on Genesis.
Nice one boys.
What about a post on why you went over to Genesis… or did I miss that one?
Editorial Staff
That will be coming soon
管理者
Gautam Doddamani
yes syed i have a lot of confusion about geneis and thesis…dont know which framework is the best…and the pros and cons of each one of em. really want your opinion on these guys..wil be waiting for ur post
Jenna Langer
Hey there, Jenna from Livefyre here. Syed, we’ve spoken about this in person, and on the phone, and of course we’re sad to see you go. A lot of the issues you were having are covered in our new Admin Dashboard (i.e. bulk actions, edit comments) and others will be fixed in the new Livefyre Comments 3 (i.e. formatting of comments, like spam, easier custom styling which is currently supported via CSS).
We’re taking all your feedback to continue to add more features to our platform, and thanks for taking the time to share it with us.
Editorial Staff
Hey Jenna, I was sad to switch away as well. I had a great time hanging out with the Livefyre crew in person. Had a pleasure working with you guys on your blog redesign. Nothing about this decision was personal. David, Amanda, Muhammad, and I discussed this thoroughly. I know that Livefyre is still a very young platform. I know you guys are working hard every day into improving the platform and making users happy. I probably would have never authorized this write up if the users didn’t ask for it. Because I had already talked to you about this via email, over the phone, and in person at BWENY. Upon the redesign, we got a lot of emails, FB messages, twitter DMs regarding the new features we added. Some users wanted to know why we switched away from Livefyre. We decided to do the article once we saw a comment on our original Livefyre article (where the user asked, why are you not using it anymore). I felt that we cannot ignore that comment. It was almost impossible to explain everything to detail in one comment. This was the reason why we did this post.
Like I said over our phone call and our in-person meeting, I am always happy to review and give feedback to improve a product (specially for friends).
管理者
Brad Dalton
I installed the Livefyre plugin and it duplicated over 1000 spam comments into approved spam comments that took me days to remove without removing the entire comments from my site.
I eventually worked out a way to remove them using a database request but it was a giant mess.
That was 6 months ago and they still haven’t come up with a fix.
Keith Davis
Hi Guys
I’ve been wondering about using Livefyre so this post has come just right for me.
Appreciate you taking the time to put the various points together and a great case you’ve made for not using LF.
Might try the facebook and twitter connect plugins – nice to integrate the social media side in to the comments.
John Bolyard
I tried LIvefyre on a few clients websites but we got a lot of feedback about the third party registration.
Good article – I was considering trying Livefyre again but I don’t think it would be worth it.
Chris Rouse
First time commenting here, but I’ve been reading for a few months. All I can say is “Thank you for abandoning Livefyre.” Another blog I read recently switched from Disqus and I haven’t been able to comment since then. This post is literally the first time I knew that I had to make a Livefyre account to leave a comment on that blog. I don’t see the point of creating another account to leave an occasional comment when Disqus and Wordpress both allow logging in with my Twitter account.
Bob R
Can I ask you a question? Why did you strip off the website field in the commenting form? Just noticed I cannot click on any of your reader’s name to see what they were up to…
Editorial Staff
As for removing the website field, the main reason is SPAM. All comment links are external nofollow. However, this doesn’t really prevent SPAM. By getting rid of the website field altogether, it gives spammers no reason to comment on our site. They can still put links in the content of their comment, but Akismet is pretty good at detecting that.
Now users should comment only if they wish to add value to the article. We do understand that this sort of takes away from user’s web identity. We are still trying to figure out how to rectify that situation. Some suggestions are adding a twitter field, so usernames link to the twitter profile. But no decision has been made yet.
管理者
Gautam Doddamani
personally i think livefyre is really not even worth to try..hehe you should definitely suggest this article to the guys at the THENEXTWEB…dey r using d same commenting platform.
one more question i wanted to ask you guys was..why did u remove the Website field in the comment section?? is it because when someone specifies his/her own site we are passing a dofollow link?
and another thing is i believe otto’s facebook and twitter connect adds a lot of plugin files slowing down the blog load time…is it still worth it?
also do you think DISQUS is a good commenting platform? they have recently released the DISQUS 2012 version and i am currently using it…and it reduces a lot of plugins. i really want your opinions on this!
Thanks in advance
Editorial Staff
Gautam, from what I have heard TNW has their own user database. So when you register there, it is different from your Livefyre account. They have also integrated Livefyre with reward based system.
As for removing the website field, the main reason is SPAM. All comment links are external nofollow. However, this doesn’t really prevent SPAM. By getting rid of the website field altogether, it gives spammers no reason to comment on our site. They can still put links in the content of their comment, but Akismet is pretty good at detecting that.
I don’t think Otto would add anything that is not necessary into the plugin. SFC and STC does have a lot of options. But he only loads those if you activate all. For us, we are only using like one feature from each of his plugins. The load time slowdown is mostly because it reaches out to the FB and Twitter API. If you have stats to prove otherwise, we would be happy to look at those.
Never tried Disqus. One lesson we learned with this was to keep our comments in-house if we want full control.
管理者
Gautam Doddamani
wao…seriously dats a very gud logic…spammers are always looking for a way to give exposure to their sites through any and all means, and now as there is no website field, only genuine commenters will spend their time commenting!
yes as for otto’s plugin..i have personally used it! yea i know, only if we activate a specific module, those particular files will be loaded..but don’t you think signing in to facebook is rather time consuming? and not to mention users already have to bypass a third party app (not yours) to actually start commenting.
i personally prefer the seo facebook comment plugin…fb users can directly comment if they are already signed into their facebook account or are visiting your post from a facebook url …they have no need to sign in…also this system is being used by techcrunch.
disqus is really worth it…i am speaking this from experience…my spam has reduced a lot and i am honestly using only one single plugin for comments. no need for akismet (in-built spam system), no need for subscribe to comments plugin or mailchimp (in-built subscribe via email/rss system), social sharing is fully supported, seo is completely organic, if there are links present in the comment dey directly goto pending or spam folder, commenters r recognized thru there unique disqus profiles and not der websites, liking (upvoting) a comment doesnt show which user upvoted a comment (unlike livefyre), and lot many other features.
Bob R
I think you’ve done the right thing. You are not the ones that decided the WP commenting system is the safest and the best option. I couldn’t comment on WP Beginner from work as we are behind some firewall that made Livefyre “dead” – I could put nothing in the comment box.
New design of wpbeginner looks great. Is this a Genesis child theme? eleven40 modified?
Editorial Staff
Yes we are glad to have you back commenting here. WPBeginner’s design is NOT a child theme of eleven40. It is a custom child theme of Genesis though
管理者
Rev. Voodoo
I read your site all the time in my google reader. But I’d given up coming to the site. I couldn’t comment on Livefyre … I’m stuck using IE at work, and it just plain wouldn’t work! I’m glad you posted this article, or I never would have known I could come and leave comments again!
Editorial Staff
Thanks for dropping by. Yes, we did notice a drop in comments from a lot of regular users like yourself.
管理者
Tony Greene
I found a plugin that merges with the Livefyre comments to keep lead generation going. However, the comment redirect plugin from Yoast failed to do this.
Shikeb Ali
It is funny that I received an email from Disqus that they are starting real-time comments and new voting features. I was really looking into it, almost about to implement it on my blog.
But now, I think will give it a second thought. ‘Cause I hate spammers too and I don’t want to spend my half day deleting spam comments.
Gautam Doddamani
shikeb disqus hav really improved their overall spam system..you dont even need aksimet now..all the comments whether they are coming from a registered or an unregistered user shud go through your moderation before it becomes approved.
and further they have made smart improvements wherein if you put a link in your comment it automatically goes into the spam folder or becomes pending until you manually approve it.
Ankur
I personally like default wordpress comment system. its simple and straight forward.
Acc to my experience, newbie are more comfortable with simple commenting system whereas people who comment more like disqus etc. Moreover, default comment system improves site loading time.
Gautam Doddamani
i totally agree with you ankur…no external javascripts, no iframes, etc will definitely increase the site load and also if we get a lot of comments we can go one step further and cache all the gravatars which will make loading a page superfast
Zhen
Having the same problem about the syncing thing and even new comments would take hours before showing up in WP dashboard. Would really hope Livefyre to work those problems out in their upcoming version.
Paul H
I’ve played with different comment systems. I liked the Facebook comments until I remembered Facebook is blocked or difficult to access in a handful of countries. You wouldn’t notice comments from China or Vietnam dropping off – but going to those countries and not being able to read parts of your own site is frustrating.
I now prefer commenting where everything works within Wordpress. Nothing worse than part of a page not loading – unless it’s the whole page not loading.
Tony Greene
What kind of value would you see coming from the commentary of countries like China or Vietnam?
Editorial Staff
WOW. So are you suggesting that the voices and opinions of people living in China and Vietnam are not important?
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Ahmad Awais
Well, I was waiting for this post, buh I shifted myself and found the original commenting system way better to customize and get subscribers.
Working with the Twitter Connect and Fb Connect , are you going to write about it or not?
Editorial Staff
Yes there might be an article on that. The process is very simple. Its merely putting in the information in the two plugins that we mentioned. Then activating the specific feature.
管理者
Shad
Should change this article to “6 Reasons Why We Switched Away from Livefyre” and fix the numbering.
Editorial Staff
Ah what a huge oversight. Fixed.
管理者
Russ Henneberry
Hey guys,
I have found LiveFyre to be very frustrating when I leave a comment. I have thrown up my hands a number of times trying to leave comments on sites that use the plug-in.
I think you made the right choice.
Russ
Lee Schuenemeyer
Won’t forcing Facebook comments fix most of these errors?
Editorial Staff
Not exactly. We will be limited to a specific platform. We would require our users to once again signup with a third party. We won’t be able to do any of the lead generation. We won’t be able to customize the look.
管理者